Calvary Chapel

Discernment is not…

Discernment is NOT research.

Discernment is NOT playing a role trying to deceive someone to give you information to fill in a “post” that in its declarative nature is to “warn,” but ends up being gossip and backbiting.

Discernment is NOT in a group of people who agree on a particular hot topic of the day to give the appearance that they are looking out for the flock, when in reality it’s self serving and self seeking to perpetuate the “appearance” of good when it is often really double handed and more misdirection.

Discernment is NOT transferred from one believer to another like a “mantle.”

Discernment is NOT reporting on the obvious.

Discernment is NOT finger pointing.

Discernment is NOT airing dirty laundry.

Discernment is NOT begrudging.

Discernment is NOT blasting away at people and their loved ones for the sake of having hits to a website.

Discernment does NOT cost anything and should not be followed by a “Donate” button.

Discernment does NOT have blogs, does NOT speak at churches all year long, does NOT collect frequent travel miles, does NOT receive “love offerings,” and does NOT have a reputation.

Discernment is NOT in a place or a person, it is NOT limited to a select group or network of people.

Discernment is NOT limited to human understanding.

Discernment is NOT knowing about secret societies and vast conspiracies.

Discernment is NOT a learned technique or one that can be taught.

Discernment is NOT a feeling, not a mystical experience, it’s not an “energy” or an “aura.”

Discernment does NOT gather or heap unto itself teachers and/or followers.

Discernment. It’s the blood that runs through the vein of many blogs lately. I understand the desire and burden to share and want to warn my fellow brethren about the dangers that abound out there in the church today. I grieve over the sorry state of the Church, God’s people, who have fallen away. I can get caught up in the hype just as easily as the next person to butter the term “Discernment” over something that is done in the flesh. I apologize to my readers, and ask you to forgive me for fleshing out and speaking in emotion rather than using a more spiritual method of exhortation. I’m referring to my previous post. The Lord has led me to a place of repentance and I know I went about it the wrong way. I cannot be used of God when my heart spews out anger and bitterness towards my former “Church” (Calvary Chapel). I’ve spent the weeks since my last post seeking His face and His direction. I love my LORD! He’s so forgiving and patient with me. His grace is unyielding and I know HE loves me. I know He loves me when He answers prayer only I know I’ve asked. Like Nathanial whom He saw under the tree, there have been things God pointed to and answered questions that I only asked in my heart. I’ve had questions about this blog, about His people, about my brethren, and His very word and how it applies to me; and lo He answered.

I recently told a friend that every time in the past when I’ve wanted to abandon my blog it was always over the same single reason, I would get in the flesh and get in the way of the work God was doing. I would begin to think the failure of the people to discern was my ineptitude to convey the tragedy and the error of others ways. I became the “acting” Holy Spirit and this is always wrong to do. I’ve never claimed to be a “Discernment” website. I don’t believe there is such a thing. I’m not a “Watchman (woman).” I’m just a geek. I’m a nerd, a dumb sheep, bleating my way through this world as a pilgrim trying to stay focused on my Savior and Lord and wishing things weren’t as bad as they appear, because they do look really bad sometimes from my perspective.

My life isn’t bad. I am truly blessed. I have a beautiful marriage, family, home, and yes, this grubby girl even gets to fellowship with other believers in a strong bible believing church. What do I have to complain about? Nothing. I have good health. My children have good health. I’m not in want of anything! Glory to God! He alone is Good and is the provider of all. So, why revisit such a nasty and painful past as my time in CC, and why revisit what they are up to these days? I have been given that answer. God delivered me out of that place, and I need to let it go completely. I need to stop picking up the topic and giving it credence in my life. My God is big enough, bigger than, the problems in CC; and, my perspective is NOT needed to make a dent in that arena. Yes, there are false teachers there. Yes, there are false ‘discerners’ who give the appearance that they are working to warn others about CC when they really work ‘for‘ CC. It’s not my job to warn you of all that. The Holy Spirit can sort it out without me. Thank God!!! Lol, you may be laughing at me right about now and saying, “wow N4TM is very self-absorbed if she thought she was at all responsible to be the movement’s sole “Warner,” and yes, it is pretty pathetic I agree! I never said I wasn’t pigheaded. I have an ego the size of my insecurities I guess. I would like to move on with my life and although I KNOW there are people who are going to revisit and poke around this website looking through all my previous Calvary Chapel posts to poke holes in my credibility, or some who are on a quest to find out the error of CC; whatever the reason for the concentrated hits to my CC posts, I will not pick the thing up and “go there.” I’m finished with the CC topic. I don’t know what that means for the future of this blog. Do I continue to post on other things? Do I walk away entirely? I don’t have answers for those yet. I know when I started this several years ago I wanted to be led by the Holy Spirit to do whatever He asked of me. Whether that is writing here or doing things in real life for His Kingdom than so be it. I’d love to be a sow-and-so. Meaning, to “sow” God’s word and not be known for doing it (so-and-so). We’ll see how the Lord leads. For now, I would like to tell you as far as I know:

Discernment IS knowing God’s word.

Discernment IS knowing the difference between good and evil by using God’s Word, His Doctrine ,as the guideline.

Discernment IS the work of the Holy Spirit in us given to us by the Holy Spirit alone and points back to God’s commandments, statutes, and His wonderful hand of Mercy and Love, that cannot be imitated by anyone else!

1 Cor 12

10 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding. Proverbs 9:10

Colossians 2

12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.

14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. Hebrews 5:12-14

Church of Christ joins Calvary Chapel via Duck Commander & Greg Laurie this past Harvest 2013

Duck Commander at Harvest Crusade 2013 tweet picMany of my readers know that I’ve written my fair share of warnings against Calvary Chapel and specifically Greg Laurie’s compromised crusade, Harvest Crusade. What I didn’t know, because I do not stalk the Christian Cult I left once I left it I stay far removed from their shenanigans, is that the Duck Commander was at Greg’s “show” this past August 2013.

I was checking my stats and saw a ‘reference’ site and clicked on it. This particular blog posted a video of Greg Laurie interviewing the “Duck Commander” (that’s not patriarchal at all). Once I clicked the YouTube video it opened up a can of worms and I sat through and watched the presentation Phil Robertson, elder at White’s Ferry Road Church, gave at the Harvest Crusade in California. I watched all 26+ minutes of it and I am going to post it here for your discerning viewing.

First things first; I have to stress this because there are some people who don’t understand my lingo or my style of writing, recently I learned that Mr. Robertson is presenting a FALSE gospel. Mr. Robertson is of the flair, Church of Christ, and they teach and preach “Baptismal Regeneration” as –essential– for salvation. Thank God someone tipped me off to this fact. I hope that the majority of my readers know by now to differentiate between truth and those who are false yet are correctly quoting God’s word.

I am posting the video of Phil Robertson today, not to endorse him or say he’s saying truth, but rather in light of learning what Baptismal Regeneration is, he clearly presents his false doctrine at the Harvest Crusade. He also presents another false doctrine in the middle of his “evangelism;” and that is, he says that ‘we’ are born “sinless.” I will give my notes following the YouTube video.

Phil Robertson is an Elder at White’s Ferry Road Church, it is a Church of Christ denomination (Christian Cult). A Christian Cult is a church/denomination/movement that proclaims Christ Jesus as their savior, however, they twist the scripture and then either add works based salvation, and/or misrepresent Doctrinal Truths. (I’m not a theologian. I’m not versed in all things Church of Christ. I am presenting to you what I’ve learned so far and sharing with you that Mr. Robertson is being embraced by the Christian community as a “brother” in Christ however he is clearly teaching against God’s word. You must use your God given discernment, and check his doctrinal statements against the Bible.)

Here is a link to a Church of Christ church that addresses WHY they believe that all men are born SINLESS. *not an endorsement http://lavistachurchofchrist.org/LVanswers/2006/12-17.htm

Phil Robertson’s church also advocates that Baptism is ESSENTIAL for regeneration. This is adding works to the work of Faith alone. I’ve addressed this in my previous post on the recent fiasco of Phil Robertson’s GQ interview that led to a nationwide anger towards Christians who believe that God’s Word declares homosexuality as a sin. You can review the information I provided there for sources on White’s Ferry Road Church teaching this false doctrine.

Within the first few minutes Phil Robertson alludes to his belief in Baptismal Regeneration, Minute 4:50- a few minutes. He also ends with his stress of Baptism around 22 minute marker for a few minutes before his ending prayer.

If you don’t know what “Baptismal Regeneration” is then you’d easily miss his comment. Look it up.

As I mentioned in the text above Phil Robertson in the middle of his presentation falsely teaches that all men are born SINLESS. This is against God’s word that states we are born sinners. This is part of Adam’s curse on us that we are all born apart from Christ. The Mormon Christian Cult also likes to teach that we are born sinless and thus they introduce further doctrinal false teachings. Minute marker 14:20 through 15:04 give or take a second, Phil Robertson states the following:

“You came from your mother, you are sinless. You know why? You didn’t know what the law said. You didn’t know what lying was & stealing, immorality, your this long out of your mother (wahhh) you want a lil milk, you say, ‘to young to know what the law said.’ However; you got a lil toddler–no problem, a lil kid–no problem, but you came to a point and you found out the same thing I did, “I know this isn’t right,” but what did you do, the same thing I did, you made a mistake, you broke God’s Law.”– Phil Robertson, the Duck Commander, at Harvest 2013

Why is Phil Robertson’s comments at Greg Laurie’s Harvest 2013 important?

Because Greg Laurie is now defending Phil Robertson over the GQ interview statements.

http://blog.pe.com/multicultural-empire/2013/12/20/duck-dynasty-greg-laurie-weighs-in-on-controversy/

Rev. Greg Laurie, senior pastor of Riverside’s Harvest Christian Fellowship, wrote a blog defending Phil Robertson, the patriarch of the hit reality-TV show “Duck Dynasty” who was suspended for comments he made about gays and lesbians.

“A plain-spoken follower of Jesus is now ‘in trouble’ for speaking his mind, and more specifically, for holding to a position that is taught in Scripture…,” Laurie wrote. “What is being asked of us is not tolerance, but acceptance and endorsement of sin. We cannot do that. We believe in God, the Creator and designer of the world and all of its creatures. We believe He has provided, as the Bible teaches, an intended design for sex and marriage. We choose to hold to that, while being tolerant of those who choose to disregard it. We stand with Scripture on the topic of homosexuality and every other sin the Bible speaks of.”

Robertson, who called homosexual behavior sinful and compared it to bestiality, appeared with Laurie at the August Harvest Crusades in Anaheim. Laurie’s blog includes an interview he had with Robertson.” Source Press Enterprise

From Greg’s Blog Post:

“I don’t know how stressed Phil is about this. He’s probably out duck hunting.

It seems to me that some people who talk the most about tolerance are the most intolerant toward anyone who dares to disagree with their views.

As Christians, we are not wanting to force our views on anyone. The fact is, we are, as a whole, tolerant of other people’s choices, even if we don’t agree with them. But what is being asked of us is not tolerance, but acceptance and endorsement of sin.

We cannot do that.

We believe in God, the Creator and designer of the world and all of its creatures. We believe He has provided, as the Bible teaches, an intended design for sex and marriage. We choose to hold to that, while being tolerant of those who choose to disregard it.
We stand with Scripture on the topic of homosexuality and every other sin the Bible speaks of.

And we will continue to tolerate and even love those that disagree with us. It would be nice if that were a two-way street.” End of Quote

Link *not an endorsement http://blog.greglaurie.com/?p=9371&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+greglaurie+%28Greg%27s+Blog%29

Greg Laurie is notorious for having ZERO discernment. He yokes with the worst of them, so his company with Phil Robertson of the Church of Christ and the blanket support he offers from Calvary Chapel of which Greg’s Harvest Church is affiliated doesn’t surprise me. It is not a shock; however, although it feels like I’m beating a dead horse with the same old news that Greg and this type of false teaching goes out in full force via the Calvary Chapel Pyramidal clan of churches, it still needs to be said. Obviously the market for lifting up men instead of God’s REAL Word hasn’t waned; and as long as God leads me to share (warn) about this stuff, I will continue to be obedient to Him. If none else, learn more about Phil Robertson’s false gospel and warn those closest to you that this man is presenting a false gospel and teaching false doctrine. What those people do with the information is their own issue.


image

The New CC “Moses” is…

brian-brodersen taking Chuck Smith Sr place at Cc

Brian Brodersen Officially Takes Senior Pastor Role at Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa; Position Held by Chuck Smith- via Christian Post

Calvary Chapel governs with “The Moses’ Model,” and yes, you’re correct that’s not biblical.

http://calvarychapel.pbworks.com/w/page/13146667/Moses-Principle

http://news4themasses.wordpress.com/2012/10/18/calvary-chapels-ungodly-seat-of-moses-government-continues-unabated/

WE BELIEVE that the church government should be simplistic rather than a complex bureaucracy, and we depend on the Holy Spirit to lead, rather than on fleshly promotion. We recognize there are various biblical models for governing a local church body; however, we follow the biblical model of a pastor-led church as demonstrated by God’s leading the nation of Israel through Moses, and by Christ leading His flock through pastors of the early church.” Source Calvary Chapel Distinctives

http://www.cccary.org/index.php/our-beliefs/distinctives

7And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi. 8But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren. 9And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. 10Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ. 11But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant. 12And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.” Matthew 23:7-12

 

 

 

Billy Graham’s final Sermon: The Cross **not an Endorsement of Billy Graham

Let me start by saying:

2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:”

-&-

15Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. 16And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.” i John 4:2 and 15

I do not have a bit of admiration for Billy Graham. I  have never watched him preach on tv or elsewhere. I’ve never listened to his old sermons. I know who he is; he is a registered Democrat, a liberal pastor who has preached to millions of people and several US presidents. I know that Billy Graham once stated that there were/are many paths to God and in doing so pluralized God and widened the Ecumenical road to hell. I know that there is high speculation that Billy Graham is/was a Mason. I know that Billy Graham has revered a few Pontiffs which is again in my view heretical and ecumenical. Billy Graham is highly influential in Crusade evangelism and hence grew close to the Calvary Chapel movement and many pastors in Calvary Chapel. I know that every time I hear “Billy Graham” referenced in church (and it’s happened at every church (and one women’s retreat) I’ve ever attended, often if not every time in a positive) I cringe and can only think of the detriment he’s caused. Stating all this, admitting my bias against Billy Graham, I still wanted to watch this ‘show’ to hear what he had to say for his last public sermon. I am after all a wannabe journalist, someone who seeks to provide the news story whether I agree or not, but I’m also a very biased blogger and I have the right to also state my perspective.

Thus I set out and I watched the above Youtube video. I did not watch the show that aired on who knows what channel so if this thing was longer I am unaware.

Setting the obvious aside Billy Graham presented the Gospel of Jesus Christ without deviation and both of the personal testimonies did as well. (not yet getting to the gritty bits and pieces of where some of these people hang their hats–wait for it people)

I’ve gotten a lot of comments condemning me for exposing things about Calvary Chapel and Chuck Smith et.al., and I’ve been wanting to write a piece in response to that issue; however, I’m still thinking about it. For now some of what I would have said in regards to Mr. Smith can be applied to Mr. Graham as well. Is Billy Graham my brother in Christ? Is he a false prophet, a false professor, a heretic? I bid you revisit 1 John 4:2 and 15. I’ll let you think about that one. If he is my brother I’m told I must love him as a brother in Christ:

20If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen? 21And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also. 1 John 4:20

I do love God. I do not hate my brother(n) or my sisters in Christ.  I love those who are completely and totally saved-born again-regenerate people but don’t look like me or fit the mold I think they should. I love even those who are in Christian cults (like Calvary Chapel) where Christ is preached and the Gospel proclaimed; and although some are saved, they are then fed false doctrines, teachings, and teachers . Prayerfully as they grow in Christ and read His word they will see and hear and get discernment and leave. I love my brothers and sisters at Calvary Chapels all across this planet. Is that clear enough?

I will go a step further than that, and say, “I also love my enemies.” Yes, I love my enemies. My God also commands me, beside loving my brothers and sisters in Christ, I must also love my enemies who seek to destroy me.

38Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: 39But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also. 41And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. 42Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

43Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. 44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; 45That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. 46For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.” Matthew 5:38-48

If Billy Graham, Lecrae, and Lacey Sturm (Flyleaf lead singer) are all not saved and they are lost, then I must love them anyway.

I watched the video, knowing a few things about Billy Graham (and a tiny bit about Lecrae’s background); although I didn’t know who “Lacey Sturm” was at first I know a little about ‘Flyleaf’; and as I watched the video, I tried to focus on what they were saying instead of my preconceived judgment calls. I could identify with both personal testimonies. I was saved from a lot, delivered from many of the same sins, and my growing up was not safe and cushy in a church culture it was the street of hard knocks, a dark place that God rescued me from. I could empathize with their testimonies. I heard clearly sinners who were saved by recognizing that they are sinners and they sounded like repentance was present, praise God. What I don’t understand is how someone can meet a great and Holy God and continue to look so dark and continue to stay in that dark lifestyle, propping up images of death and symbols reserved for Satan’s minions. Despite my coming from a “liberal, evangelical, non-denominational” church at my beginnings, I was still impressed that yes, God makes all things new and the old man (in my case the old chick who sinned without conviction) is now a new creature; and I put off the old things, and that included my dress, my music, and my paraphernalia. Perhaps I was pendulum swinging, and I went full throttle into being a “Christian” both on the inside and on the outside, but that’s what God did in my life. Over the years I’ve learned to let go of my Pharisaical ways but now I’m just old and dogmatic about things because I’m older and dogmatic about things.

For instance, how do you justify this:

Lacey Strum Flyleaf concert with whosoevers 2012lacey Strum with the Whosoevers

whosoevers junk

A picture is worth 1,000 words they say, so I’ll let these images do their own speaking.

I get that not everyone can receive the message of Christ from a pew, in a clean sterilized “sin-free” zone. I mean really, there is no such place. I trust that God can call His own in unique ways and when He does it’s always a miracle. I heard the gospel at Calvary Chapel for goodness sakes, my salvation is true and real, I didn’t lose my salvation when I walked out of the dove laden doors. I didn’t have to get saved again; because as I grew in Christ I grew up to an understanding that there were deep rooted false teachers in the system that is Calvary (Chapel), and I most certainly don’t think that everyone who gets saved has to look like me, or talk like me. I’m not better than any of my fellow Christians.

I do think however that Satan likes to keep people chained to darkness although they have had encounters with the light. I do believe children (state of maturity in Christ) need to grow up and get out of feeling the need to prop up pop culture within the church body and show the next generation how to become mature Christians. Getting tattoos and wearing Satanic symbols is not going to preach the Gospel of Christ to the heathen, it only encourages them to stay as they are. Calvary Chapel used a mantra back in the day, I’m not sure if they still say this, “Come as you are,” but that was never a license to stay in a permanent state of defilement!

That young lady Lacey had a beautiful story of redemption. I was impressed by her 180 degree turn to a loving God and recognizing that she was “so not good.” Then as I pieced together that this was the same head singer of fly leaf I was thinking, why does she continue to look so dark and sad and stuck in bondage? Why put on the cloak of all the emotional baggage she claims God delivered her from? I don’t get it, but maybe that’s good.

I scrolled through images of her and noticed that her tattoos change and appear and disappear in different photos. Is it merely an image, a facade, acting? Certainly she was dramatic in the Billy Graham video and she apparently is very often emotional. (fruit of self control?) The hanging of the hat with elk like “The Whosoevers?” I think there’s a verse about bad company corrupting good morals. The Whosoevers emblems are down right demonic and another blogger has written sufficient enough about them that I don’t have to reinvent the wheel.

See here. http://galatiansfour.blogspot.com/2012/08/the-whosoevers-christian-band-and-their.html (and there are much more on the same site)

If this is Billy Graham’s last sermon, extracting what his company said and who they are, the message of what Christ did for us on the Cross is true. It’s a shame that you have to muck through all this other stuff. The unsaved person wouldn’t know a lick about Flyleaf, or Lacey Sturm, or understand or question Lecrae’s emblem on his shirt in this piece. The lost person won’t understand why a supposed Christian Pastor who proclaims Jesus Christ alone is shown shaking hands with the Pope (Paul ll now deceased), or ever heard that Billy Graham once stated “All roads lead to Heaven.”

If this is all the sinner saw and heard, I pray they heard the Gospel, the Word of God that was strategically interwoven through the mud and that God’s two edged sword, His word, His love penetrated through the marrow and the despair and saved a soul. Jesus Christ does want to save the Lost, to redeem the cold hearted sinner and give new life to people who are dead in their trespasses. Get to the Cross of Calvary, meet Jesus, know that he died for you, but he’s not dead; He’s ALIVE! He’s risen! He makes intercession for you. He wants to change all of you in a dramatic way and He can if you allow Him. All this other stuff, the crazy tatt’d up Christians the ones who continue to cry in misery, don’t look to them, look to a victorious Lord and Savior. Learn about who He is from His word.

Articles of interest:

Billy Graham Is No Longer Saying Mormonism Is a Cult For Some Reason- source Slate.com

Billy Graham’s Website Removes Mormons from Cult Page, After Graham Endorses Mitt Romney- source Opposing Views.com

Billy Graham Magazine: Mormons Aren’t Christians- Source Talk to Action

Loving the sinner, the lost, and the misdirected saved born again Christian is not the same as saying the lost unregenerate Christ denier can get to heaven. Saying I love my brothers and sisters in Christ doesn’t translate to me endeavoring with them in their false teachings. Love is not license to love them to hell, which is what we do if we do not tell them that there is Only One Way to God the Father and that is through Jesus Christ LORD and Savior. So then, this message of Billy Graham above is not the same as what he’s said in the past:

http://youtu.be/-gtR8rp4ozw  Billy Graham says all roads lead to Heaven, even non-believers. That is not the gospel message that is ecumenical at best heretical at worst. It’s a lie from the pit of hell. Did Billy Graham change his tune, back toward a solid gospel?  Or is he merely trying to redeem his missteps and false teachings? I don’t have the answer to that.

I do know that Christ warned us of false teachers, rising from among ‘us.’ We are to know them, to recognize them, and know our Bible enough to rebuke false teachings when we hear them.

The More Things Change, The More They Stay the Same.

I left a cult called Calvary Chapel. I know many people who attend Calvary Chapel and don’t see it as a cult and rightly so, they probably don’t invest much time at church or serve or know the ins and outs of the creation of the church, its church history, or care to know more than what they hear on Sunday morning. And to those who stay ignorant, more power to you, that’s how to stay solely focused on Christ and not let church politics, liars, and false teaching get in the way of your “relationship” with Christ. Although, there has been a lot to be said about knowing the actual Word of God versus depending on what men from the pulpit teach, but I digress.

I wanted to be done with the “Calvary Chapel” topic! Oh so bad, you have no idea how many times I’ve cremated the past and yet there it is before my eyes, regenerated and lurking about my mind! It doesn’t help when my past ‘adventures’ in CC and learning all the things I did there come back to life in another church I’m attending. Hence, the title of this blog post, “The more things change (attending a completely different type of church than CC), The More They Stay The Same (undiscerning people, holding up men, using false teachers as a source, etc!!).” In many respects the church I’ve been attending for the past year is very much like the CC church. They are both “Movements,” they both are dispensationalist, pre-trib, “Conservative,” Bible believing, Bible teaching, churches. One is more extremely antiquated; they are KJV only, they would prefer women to wear burqas, and there will never be a drum beat, bass guitar, or rhythm in the worship-ever.

Boykin don JesuitSo, what’s got me in an exegetical conniption fit this morning?  Jesuit, retired general William “Gerry” Boykin, was used as a source this past mid-week service. I guess I should have known when the assistant pastor the first time I was there quoted St. Francis of Assisi that this subject matter was bound to come up! But Boykin? Really? Boykin makes no apologies appearing on Morning Star (Rick Joyner–another open Jesuit/Christian) or the Oak Initiative. Boykin is EMBRACED by Calvary Chapel, a “cult” clearly identifiable to the current church I’m attending. How is it that this flaming liar of a man is quoted? Because men love men; and I don’t mean in a homosexual way here, I’m saying “men,” ie Human nature, love “men,” to lift up other men of renown as if it makes them sound more knowledgeable or important. It was the folly of Calvary Chapel and it appears to be a hazard everywhere. When I first started attending the current church I’m attending I saw its mentality for all things holy and pure to be appealing. The longer I am there the more the reality of what is really going on there shows and it’s ok, I get it, people are people, and the church is not perfect, the people at the church are not perfect, and I know I will never be perfect and hence I brought all my issues with me when I began attending there, so if it was the perfect church a year prior, because of my presence alone it is now tainted. I’m not ignorant or delusional that there is a church without its issues. I really truly wanted to settle down, invest in a place for my children to grow up hearing the word of God. I cannot imagine what moving churches has already done to my kids. We’ve moved out of two Calvary Chapels, then one other non-Calvary Chapel, before this one that we are currently attending.

I did what any pig headed recovering Calvary Chapel person would do, I let the pastor know that “General William Boykin is a Jesuit.”

I know, wrong move, I should have just shut my trap and nodded and said an amen or something but I couldn’t! I have seen too much, I know too much. This lil church should be spared from the infiltration of this Jesuit Psy-op false teacher!!! But you know what, the more things change, the more they stay the same. I will tell you that I don not think the information I gave was received, (it was read and replied to but it was not “received”) or appreciated. I believe it fell on deaf ears and that my meddling was not fruitful.

What do I do now? Once again I’m made aware that false teachers are to a degree “accepted” and that my big mouth hasn’t learned to let things be. I have once again tried to warn the pastor to be met with obstinence. I don’t want to abandon corporate worship. I don’t want to be hunkered down alone with my family and not interacting with other Christians. Maybe Jesuits are ok when they are Christians? Maybe Jesuits are ok when they are decorated war veterans, generals, businessmen, government employees, Senators, presidential candidates? Jesuits make an oath to the Pope and the “Mother Church” (Catholicism) correct? I guess it’s no matter if the person taking the oath is a supposed “Christian,” right? Why are some Jesuits like the Pope not okay, but others are? I must be dumb as a rock to not understand the absolute double mindedness of this? So, if Jesuits are ok, what’s wrong with a stringed instrument? huh?

Posts by N4TM on Boykin and his Jesuitism, and others’ Jesuitism…

http://news4themasses.wordpress.com/2012/02/02/jesuits-are-good-christians-are-evil/

http://news4themasses.wordpress.com/2012/02/16/politricks/

http://news4themasses.wordpress.com/2012/08/22/the-craft/

http://news4themasses.wordpress.com/2012/01/15/jesuits-begt-jesuits-norman-geisler-veritas-calvary-chapel-bible-college/

** this most recent article addressed by N4TM and why I believe Boykin to be a liar and a conspirator: http://news4themasses.wordpress.com/2013/06/14/jesuit-general-william-jerry-boykin-outs-his-fellow-conspirators-brigitte-gabriel-and-allen-west/

Outside N4TM:

The Holy Warrior- CBS covers Boykin’s remarks and new employment speaking at Christian Churches in uniform.

US general ‘censured’ for remarks- BBC covers Boykin’s remarks

read-save- the Department Of Ddefence report of General William Boykin: http://www.dodig.mil/FOIA/ERR/h03l89967206.pdf

screenshot boykin dod report 08.05.2004The DOD once found Lt. General William “Gerry” Boykin guilty of misconduct but I submit that it has been to the government’s advantage to have a psy-op commander in the churches disseminating “news” that serves their agenda. When one door closed for Boykin, another opened very widely.

“I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.” 1 John 2:21

For the record, there is another Retired General, Peter Pace, who is also a Jesuit.

Gen Peter Pace retired Jesuit

Marine Gen. Peter Pace (Ret.) began his military service as a platoon leader in Vietnam and ended as principal military advisor to the president of the United States before retiring from the Marine Corps in 2007. Born in Brooklyn and raised in Teaneck, N.J., he earned his commission at the U.S. Naval Academy, later serving as deputy commander of Joint Task Force Somalia and commander in chief of the U.S. Southern Command. He served as vice chairman and then as chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the first Marine to serve in either position. In June 2008, he was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom, the highest civilian honor the president of the United States can bestow.

Gen. Pace holds an M.B.A. from George Washington University and serves on the advisory council for Fordham’s Graduate School of Business Administration. He supports charities including serving as chairman of the board for Wall Street Warfighters Foundation, an organization that provides training, support and job placement services for disabled veterans interested in careers in financial services.

Founded in 1841, Fordham is the Jesuit University of New York, offering exceptional education distinguished bythe Jesuit tradition to approximately 14,700 students in its four undergraduate colleges and its sixgraduate and professional schools. It has residential campuses in the Bronx and Manhattan, a campus in Westchester, the Louis Calder Center Biological Field Station in Armonk, N.Y., and the London Centre at Heythrop College in the United Kingdom.
05/11

Source: http://www.fordham.edu/Campus_Resources/eNewsroom/topstories_2111.asp

Also: The link that was here has been removed thanks to a reader who alerted me that the blogger who posted the link of a list of Jesuit trained people is a little “off” to say the least. You don’t need his link to discover who’s a Jesuit. You can do your own google search if you suspect someone of being a Jesuit and find plenty of site sources for yourself.  Any cached link of this post will have the removed link, or if you have an email alert of posts it’ll be there-Disregard such a link as “proof.” Also, since I haven’t stated Emphatically Enough–NO LINK IS EVER AN ENDORSEMENT BY N4TM even 100% verifiable links like Reuters-AP-etc of “news” but more especially blog links. once again– LINKS ARE NEVER AN ENDORSEMENT. thanks, N4TM

!!:-) praise report!
God is so awesome. He is even though I thought this was one more time things were dismissed. I just got a second reply from the pastor; because of course I had to reply to the first reply. Here is the latest update: I replied with clarification that Mr. Boykin is a professing Christian (not a Catholic which he was under the impression of upon my disclosure that he is a Jesuit) and he expressed concern and shock. He encouraged me to not “be sorry” (which I stated I was for bringing up the topic) and stated this (Boykin’s ties to Baptist churches and non denominations) are troublesome and point to the days we are living in. :-) Glory to God! I had hoped for at least that much that the message would be in the least received and considered and it sounds like it has. Good news. I’m sure there will be more opportunities as that is inevitable because Satan never stops trying to stumble people. For today at least I can report that this situation shows promise. I know only the Holy Spirit can reveal and today’s lesson has encouraged me, that maybe the Lord is using me :-)

 

**UPDATE**

Rick Joyner, fellow Jesuit, co laborer with Ret. General William Gerry Boykin, has recently stated that the US (White house government under Obama) needs to be taken over militarily.

Click Here for the full Article and video of Rick Joyner making these statements of his own will: http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/david/christian-tv-host-asks-god-military-takeover

I saw an article over at GalatiansFourblogspot which tipped me off: here is link to that post: http://galatiansfour.blogspot.com/2013/10/nwo-knights-of-malta-rick-joyner-our.html

Fake Pastor arrested for Preaching ‘Not Guilty’ of Misdemeanor charge Hemet,CA Calvary Chapel related

chp arrested mark mackeyI reported on this “Pastor” (preacher) who was arrested in Hemet, California for preaching to a group of people at the local DMV. Mark Allen Mackey and Brett Coronado are the two individuals who were “arrested” back in February of 2011. They were arrested because they had been forewarned that they needed to comply with the law and get a permit to preach at the DMV and the Courthouse (another spot they liked to hold their “Evangelism.”) Both refused to seek a permit and knew that every time they went to these places they were soon to be arrested for their actions. They were warned and knew arrest was a possibility so much so that they brought their camera to the preaching sessions so that they could capture their “arrest” video and cry foul.

“Not Guilty” says Judge.

“A judge acquitted two preachers of a misdemeanor criminal charge that was filed against them after their religious efforts at the Hemet DMV in 2011 ended in their arrest on suspicion of holding a demonstration on state property without a permit. Superior Court Judge Tim Freer found Brett Anthony Coronado and Mark Allen Mackey not guilty of the charge Tuesday, Aug. 13.” Source: Press Enterprise

My headline for this post correctly states, “Fake Pastor arrested,” because neither one of these men were pastors at the time of their arrest. Well, in Calvary Chapel circles they probably were considered a “Pastor” since they can deem anyone a Pastor. Semantics aside, only Brett Coronado had the position of Assistant Pastor at one time, the other, Mark Allen Mackey was never a “Pastor.” They both had been released by their senior pastor, Gary Johnson, the real senior Pastor of Calvary Chapel Hemet who was not involved in this charade.

“According to the Press Enterprise who quoted Gary Johnson, the real senior Pastor of Calvary Chapel Hemet, Gary had this to say about his two “former” brothers;

CHP Officer Darren Meyer, who made the arrest, said the group was warned repeatedly that they needed a permit leading up to the day they were arrested without warning.

Coronado and Mackey are no longer part of Calvary Chapel Church in Hemet. They have formed their own church, Reconciled Fellowship, said Calvary Chapel Pastor Gary Johnson.

Johnson said in an email that the men had almost been arrested several times prior to the incident and knew they needed a permit prior to going to the DMV.

“I had been attempting to temper their style of evangelism,” Johnson said. “They revolted at the idea that they were wrong and eventually left the church …” Source: N4TM original post on this story.

Persecution.org tweeting propagandaThe other day I saw this tweet by Persecution.org. They tweeted this story as if it happened yesterday. The arrests were in 2011. These men were not sitting in prison or even jail, they were charged with a misdemeanor and that was the end of it. They probably wanted to be persecuted, they perhaps wanted to have a greater story to tell, but the Judge did well in not obliging them with any more attention than they already sucked dry. *note the comments to that tweet, already 70 had RT’d it and others buying the lie that this is a persecution story! Sheesh, people, get a critical thinking cap.

In my opinion these men knew they would be arrested because they knew the consequences for preaching to a captive audience without a lawful permit. It is my opinion that they wanted to be arrested. They were trying to put a fledgling new church together called, Reconciled Christian Fellowship, they were just coming out of Calvary Chapel, and needed attention. I don’t know what happened to their strip mall church meeting. I’m sure if they’re not there, they are somewhere trying to start a church rather than get a job and make an honest living. Not all men who say they are Pastors are truly pastors. How do these men represent Christ by disobeying the law of the land, by conning people for money to handle their “legal fees” when they brought on the trouble to themselves? This is what gives people a distaste for Christianity and Christians. It’s sad when the gospel of Jesus Christ is treated like this.

If you’re not saved; if you’re not walking with the Lord as you read this post, I pray you don’t get swayed to think that all Christians are like Mackey and Coronado. Look to Jesus in His word and read how He taught others and brought them to the truth. Don’t let the sins and folly of these men keep you from truly knowing Jesus Christ.

To the brethren, we may be persecuted soon enough, we don’t need to lift these two guys up and claim they are suffering “religious persecution” when they are not. There is a real enemy out there who seeks to devour and our time of freedom to share the gospel may be coming to an end, and that should make us all the more diligent to represent Christ righteously not foolishly.

Murrieta Patch- http://murrieta.patch.com/groups/police-and-fire/p/men-arrested-for-reading-bible-at-dmv-acquitted

Pandering to the Christians, Persecution.Org story- http://www.persecution.org/2013/08/09/california-pastor-prosecuted-for-reading-bible-in-public-goes-to-trial/

January 2012- Hearing postponed- Murrieta Patch- http://murrieta.patch.com/groups/police-and-fire/p/hearing-postponed-for-evangelists-accused-of-preachinb5f9fe87af

March 2012 Article on these guys from Press Enterprise- http://www.pe.com/local-news/riverside-county/hemet/hemet-headlines-index/20120329-hemet-city-launches-defense-in-dmv-demonstration.ece

You can’t spell Faux without FOX! Here’s how the National Main Stream Media spread the fake story through Foxnews of course- http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/29/taking-liberties-arrested-for-reading-bible/

What is Truth? Depends on who you ask. Let’s ask Douglas Hamp.

“What is truth?”–Pontious Pilate

One of the most infamous questions and one that plagues everyone at some point in their life, and the inquisitor asked the One person whom all generations after would love to address it to, Jesus the Christ the Messiah of Israel and Savior of the World.

In equal zeal we should ask these questions to those who espouse to teach us “truth.” There are false teachers under every denomination, sect, and culture. The wolves within the body of Christ should alarm us; however, we often find ourselves tolerating them and entertaining them at times as part of our hum drum day, but this shouldn’t  be so. If this is the case, we are indeed luke-warm in our walk, we can all agree that the body of Christ is already luke-warm.

When men come to your church and start teaching you “newly inspired” interpretations of the Bible, specifically eschatology in Douglas Hamp’s case, but also generally and most disturbingly in respects to new doctrine, we should all stand up at attention and demand they prove their “truth.” (but itching ears more than often win!)

Who is Douglas Hamp?

I was asked this by a concerned brother in the Lord who knows I escaped the clutches of Calvary Chapel “Movement.” My brother told me, he (Hamp), taught at Calvary Chapel College in Murrieta, he was assistant pastor at Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa for six years. I instinctively thought, “there’s your sign-right there.” However, for the non familiar of the CC cult speakers it’s not as cut and dry. An explanation of “Who” Douglas Hamp is of importance, so I am obliging a friend and delving into the arena of CC false teachers yet again if only to provide my friend with information so that he can better warn his friends who are bringing him this “hot, new, revelation of end times stuff.”

The following bio is from a site called “SoundChristian” ironically many false teachers are listed with a (+) sign for being “Sound” so please Do Not take this quote as an endorsement of that site. I always link to where I get my info but that is never indicative of an endorsement.

Douglas Hamp Having a focused ministry on the end-times, he has extensively researched and written that for some time we have been witnessing the return of fallen angels in the form of aliens.  Being a Hebrew scholar and expert on ancient languages, he suggests Daniel 2:43 predicts that demonic entities will crossbreed with humans in order to destroy the image of God in the last days, just as humans were corrupted in the days of Noah described in Genesis 6.  He also says that demonic forces are preparing for a counterfeit rapture event by sending messages through “spirit guides” who are claiming the earth will soon go through a period of cataclysmic changes, including a “great evacuation.”  This deception is meant to prepare people for a coming sudden disappearance of people that will be accomplished via thousands of UFOs.  He is an author, researcher, lecturer and conference speaker.  He offers more information at douglashamp.com.

This latest book by Hamp is all the buzz. Here’s a book description from Amazon.com:

Book Description

July 1, 2011Corrupting the Image Douglas Hamp book cover
Something ominous is coming upon the world: it is Satan’s final effort in the battle to destroy the image that man was created in, which has been raging since the beginning of time. If Satan can destroy the image, then he can avert his own destruction. The prophecy of Genesis 3:15 states the serpent will one day mix his seed with humanity as a counterfeit of the Messiah. Jesus told us that the last days will be like the days of Noah when fallen angels mixed their seed with humanity. In the Book of Daniel we read that “they” will again mingle with the seed of men. How so? Satan will use man’s desire to be his own god to deceive him into believing the ultimate lie – that his fallen messengers are both the creators and saviors of man. He will not do this openly but will deceive mankind through demons which are masquerading as ”aliens” who are spreading the message that the inhabitants of the earth can evolve to be like them and obtain transcendent powers. Finally, the seed of the Serpent will come; he will be a man who will be greater than his fellows, who will understand sinister schemes and shall rise up and become the Antichrist. That day of fulfillment is nearly upon us!” End of Quote from Amazon.com

Just from this small excerpt/description the reader should note how heretical it is. Genesis 3:15 does NOT say, “the serpent will one day mix his seed with humanity as a counterfeit of the Messiah.” Here is the scripture in context:

Genesis 3:13-16

13 And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.

14 And the Lord God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:

15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.”

Douglas Hamp has effectively (falsely) altered the entire bible and all it’s prophecies concerning the Return of Christ and the rise of the Anti-Christ based on Genesis 3:15 where God mentions, the serpent’s (Satan’s) seed. This reference entitles him to interpret the bible to mean that Satan’s offspring, i.e. the Nephilim that were present upon the earth at the “time of Noah” which caused God to resent creating man and thusly flood the earth saving only Noah’s family, are the same who will return as “Aliens” and create a hybrid man/Nephilim (ergo the Anti-Christ). It was man’s SIN upon the whole earth that God loathed and sought to destroy in the flood. It is the same SIN resonance and fever pitch that is plaguing today’s society as well, as in the days of Noah.

Easy enough summation of Douglas Hamp’s false teaching. It coincides with Chuck Missler’s heresy and LA Marzulli, David Ick, Tom Horn and many many others.

The catch to believing this false teaching is that you have to read the Book of Enoch. The book of Enoch is considered an apocryphal book. A non-canonized book that is extra-biblical and not inspired by the Holy Spirit.

It’s no wonder this new boy wonder came from Calvary Chapel. Don’t forget Chuck Smith Sr. believes in the Gap Theory of evolution. He began Calvary Chapel with the likes of Chuck Missler; a kabalist, mystic, military intelligence boy genius who believes we live in a hologram and Demons are Aliens who can jump through portals into our world. Missler also teaches that Satan has a seed and believes in trans humanism. Missler and his friend William Welty a New Age believer constructed the Blue Letter Bible online resource that has the Greek and Hebrew concordance to assist in twisting the bible to mean what they want it to mean. Missler is also a dear confidant of Timothy LaHaye. LaHaye was a friend of “Jesus” (re-incarnate) Reverend Sun Myung Moon, and creator of the Council for National Policy, the religious right wing military industrial complex lobbying front. Let’s not forgot Smith Sr’s relationship to Jesuit Retired General William Gerry (Jerry) Boykin. Many of the upper echelon, global elites, are tied to CC, yet CC apologist never draw the full connection, even when they are “warning” the flock of that very elk. Weird huh.

In a NUTshell:

This is what Douglas Hamp believes in:

“There we find that it is Hebrew word #2232 zera that was translated as seed in Genesis 3:15. And in this context it means “offspring” or “children”. In fact, we’ll take a look at it further down, but the Greek equivalent of this word used by Christ in reference to the Serpent’s “Seed” is word #4687 sperma. And yes if you’re wondering, it does indeed mean “male sperm”.

Can there now be any doubt as to what this “seed” is?

It’s obvious that the Serpent’s “seed” represents Satan’s “literal” descendants who live on earth until the prophecy in Genesis 3:15 is complete – i.e. when the head of the Serpent is crushed. They were planted on earth via Satan’s “sperm”. 

Cain was Satan’s son.

And his descendants today are called “Kenites”.

You see the “fruit” Eve partook of wasn’t a big red juicy apple like the religionists try and tell us. Eve was sexually seduced by Satan. And the result of that was her bearing the wicked fruit of the Devil in her womb (2 Cor 11:2-3).” Source: The Serpent Seed>> In-Depth Analysis of Genesis 3:15 The Serpent Seed Doctrine

**Annotation** For a precise account of exactly what Hamp believes you must read (copy/print/save) his own words on the Serpent Seed Doctrine. Because YES he absolutely believes in the Serpent Seed Doctrine. Here is his article, his words, from his blog, that he removed but I located. (And I already have a hard copy should this archive disappear)

http://web.archive.org/web/20111114064627/http:/www.douglashamp.com/the-genetics-of-satan%E2%80%99s-seed-and-the-mark-of-the-beast/

Here is an excerpt from that article: “The Genesis 3:15 prophecy speaks of two seeds: the seed of the woman (her seed) and the seed of Satan (your seed). Jewish and Christian interpreters were convinced that the reference to her seed found its culmination in Jesus the Messiah and we fully examined just how that was possible genetically. Because the fulfillment of “her seed” was the genetic mixing of the earthly (Mary) with the heavenly/divine (Holy Spirit) then it follows that the fulfillment of “your seed” will follow in like manner. Therefore, because the incarnation of the Messiah was the Mary’s seed plus the Holy Spirit (human seed + spiritual seed), the embodiment of the anti-Messiah ought to be a mingling of human seed plus Satan (who is opposed to the woman). We conclude therefore that the antichrist will genetically be the son of Satan.”

And this: “We conclude therefore that the little horn (Antichrist/Beast) will begin as a man and then become the genetic son of Satan. It is important to note that he will begin as a regular man: Though the Lord will use him to in part judge the world, he was not predestined to be the Antichrist but he will choose to become a hybrid (Nephilim) with Satan to fulfill his purposes.[vi] He will have free choice all the way until the Lord Jesus returns to destroy him. We know that he begins as a man from several clues in Scripture:”

This is junk science at best and completely demonic at worst. His site sources for his theory-ology is Tom Horn! Paranormal chaser, alien believer, con-artist, Tom Horn.

Hamp is a false teacher. In my opinion it’s easy to spot. I watched an entire “movie” done by Hamp’s friend Gonzo Shimura, called “Age of Deceit.” Hamp is in this “film.” Together they lay the foundation for believing that Satan’s seed/offspring are today’s current Aliens and that they are going to return as such and do what exactly I’m not totally sure, either the Aliens will “enlighten” us or kill us, either way “Aliens are real and they’re here to stay” -LA Marzulli. Remember the days when your mom and your pastor would tell you not believe in such lies, now the Pastor has a conference in his church to tell you that Aliens are Real!  LA Marzulli is also a source in this film, as well as David Icke, Chuck Missler, and other Satanists who channel demons who give them the layout of the coming invasion. It’s sheer ridiculousness how far man can get from the truth when it’s staring them right in the face. I won’t embed the video but I’ll link to it here if you can manage to waste 2 and half hours of your life on the twisted theology these men have contrived than go ahead. I regret to inform you I had time to waste and watched it. In the film, Hamp states as has Chuck Missler, “Jesus was born of a woman and no father. The Holy Spirit had to provide the “Y” chromosome for Jesus.” Hence, the logic goes, the Anti-Christ has to come in like manner, his DNA has to be different than any other human. If you listen carefully by saying this about Satan and linking it to Jesus’ conception, Hamp and Missler are also saying something about Jesus. Jesus is an “Uberman,” in their opinion, he’s transhuman, he’s a super-being, like Clark Kent. When I heard Missler explain his theology, his doctrine, I instantly knew he was denying Christ and he is teaching another Christ, another gospel. It was just that easy for me. You have to accept his logic in order to accept his theology interpretation. His end-times theology interpretation is his doctrine. He uses extra-biblical sources to support his whacked out theories so if you haven’t read the book of Enoch and Jasher not to mention the books of Hebrew mystics than you’re not up to his level of intelligence and he won’t have a discussion with you. If you can’t decode the “intelligence” data provided in these heretical manuscripts and morph them to compliment the Bible than you’re a peon and can’t comprehend the plan of God. In the film, Age of Deceit, the author/producer, says affirmatively he believes these things. You have to hear it for yourself.

Where in the bible does Jesus say “beware of Aliens coming?” Where in the bible are we warned that Aliens are Demons? Where is it in the bible that says that the New Age Religion is going to be the ‘one world’ religion of the last days because everyone will want to do an evolutionary jump into the next stage of humanism? Where in the bible do you read about Portals and holograms? I don’t see it, but I do read things like, they come as ministers of light, false teachers will rise among you, beware lest you fall being seduced by DOCTRINES of demons. It appears more like these men who want to keep people on an endless stream of Alien juice, believing that “when aliens come on the scene,” that’s right, not if-but “WHEN” aliens come on the scene they will be demons. Why would a demon need to come as an Alien, when they can come as a pastor or a speaker or an author?

**UPDATE** Here are the video clips I wanted to present. What I had to do was snip out the parts of Douglas Hamp from the film, Age of Deceit, to show exactly what Hamp believes (his interpretation of doctrine) and then combine them into one video. There are key words to listen for: Recombinant DNA, Chimera, etc.

Here are two excerpts from Douglas Hamp’s book “Corrupting the Image.”

“The technology known as recombinant DNA in fact now makes it possible for a grown man or woman to be altered at the genetic level. If a non-human gene were introduced into the human genome then the person would no longer be fully human but would by definition become a hybrid. The ancient name for a creature that is composed of different kinds is known as a chimera and that is also the name given to hybrid creatures in a previous [study] such as the spider goat and the green glowing pigs….

Recombinant DNA is “hybrid DNA that has been created from more than one source. The basic procedure is where a DNA strand is opened up and then a gene from another organism is inserted, making a new strand of DNA. The RNA replicates the new strand and it is passed into the entire system. “When recombinant DNA is then further altered or changed to host additional strands of DNA, the molecule formed is referred to as a “chimeric” DNA molecule, with reference to the mythological chimera that consisted as a composite of several animals.” By means of recombinant DNA, Satan may be able to convince humanity to insert demonic genes, perceived as desirable, into the human genome. The genetic composition of the person, therefore, would result in that person becoming a chimera.

Using recombinant DNA, a fully mature man could inject himself with the selected gene or genes of another species. The process, which is really just a matter of copying and pasting, is explained by T. Wakayama et al. in the July 1998 issue of Nature:

In the late 70’s, Dr. Stan Cohen (Stanford) studying antibiotic resistance plasmids in E coli, and Dr. Herb Boyer (UCSF) studying restrictive enzymes […] realized that they could use restriction enzymes to cut both plasmid DNA as well as DNA containing a gene of interest, and combine the DNA’s so that the “sticky ends” of each DNA could be joined, or “spliced,” to make a recombinant DNA (i.e. bacteria human).

Therefore, we can see how a man with access to technology and to Satan’s seed could then merely inject it into his DNA; then once inserted his own RNA would copy the new strands with the foreign gene(s) and it would spread throughout his entire system. Once this process of replication was complete the man would no longer be a mere human; he would in essence be a chimera, a hybrid: he would be a beast!

Source: Corrupting the Image, Angels, Aliens, And Fallen Angels revealed, Douglas Hamp, Defender Publishing, Copyright 2011, second printing 2012, pages 243-245.

More discombobulated theology here:

“The final proof that the toes/horns/kings are demons comes from Revelation 17:12, which we have already considered as proof that the ten kings are equal to the horns. However, if we zoom in just a bit we notice something important; the ten horns “are ten kings” (deka basileis eisin […] which “have received no kingdom yet.” John was told that there are kings (current to his day) that do not yet have a kingdom. However, these same kings (alive in John’s day) will receive their kingdoms when the Beast rises to power. It has been nearly two thousand years since John received the Revelation from Jesus on the island of Patmos. What human kings have been alive for two thousand years?  Clearly the answer is none! Therefore, the only option left are the kings that do not die but continue—demons do not physically die and therefore the ten kings were present back in John’s day, had no kingdom but will receive the kingdom when the Beast comes, and so we conclude that the kings are necessarily demonic kings. We known that the understanding of “are kings”, signifying that they were alive in John’s day, must be right because Jesus used the same grammatical argument against the Sadducees to prove the resurrection: “I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living” (Matthew 22:23).

Thus we see that in the last days, rulers of this dark age (Ephesians 6:12) will mingle their seed with humans just as they did in the days of Noah and also when the children of Israel went into the Promised Land. So, just as Jesus predicted, the days of His return would be like the days of Noah. The sons of God took women and the fruit of their union was the Nephilim. So too the last days will be marked by the coming of these Nephilim. In fact we see that these days have already begun to be fulfilled and so our Lord’s return cannot be far away.” Source: Ibid, pages 179-180.

**The following excerpt is taken from Douglas Hamp’s blog, article entitled, “The Genetics of Satan’s Seed and the Mark of the Beast” November 10,2011**

The Genesis 3:15 prophecy speaks of two seeds: the seed of the woman (her seed) and the seed of Satan (your seed). Jewish and Christian interpreters were convinced that the reference to her seed found its culmination in Jesus the Messiah and we fully examined just how that was possible genetically. Because the fulfillment of “her seed” was the genetic mixing of the earthly (Mary) with the heavenly/divine (Holy Spirit) then it follows that the fulfillment of “your seed” will follow in like manner. Therefore, because the incarnation of the Messiah was the Mary’s seed plus the Holy Spirit (human seed + spiritual seed), the embodiment of the anti-Messiah ought to be a mingling of human seed plus Satan (who is opposed to the woman). We conclude therefore that the antichrist will genetically be the son of Satan.

How could that be possible? We recall that Adam and Eve were made in God’s image and emitted light like a garment. The image was tainted at the Fall and they lost the light garments. God promised a redeemer to restore the Image and restore the light garments. The Messiah mixed genetically with humanity to rescue us and upon resurrection we get our new bodies with the image restored. However, only those who follow Jesus (by ‘dying to self’) will receive the restored Image.

Concurrently, Satan attempted to destroy the image genetically with the Nephilim both before the flood and after the flood (the sons of God returned). Daniel 2:43 prophesied of a mixing of the seed (distortion of the image). We have learned that the alien”(demonic) abductees report their seed being harvested and that the “Aliens” (demons) are creating a hybrid race between them and us. All the while they (demons) are warning of impending cataclysms coming upon the world and are purporting that they will raise up a super human leader in our time of need. Lastly, we saw that the Transhumanist movement is seeking to improve man by way of changing his genetic code and via recombinant DNA it is possible to alter an adult individual at the most fundamental level. Source: Douglas Hamp

[] N4TM Commentary: There is much more to this guy’s false teachings. Frankly I don’t see that anyone cares so I’ll end with this because I ‘knew’ it was coming from a demonic source but I had too keep digging until I could pin point a specific origin. This may be the closest thing to its origination or just scratch the surface, but from here on out I am going to stop reading about all this because it’s so disturbing. More disturbing is so many willful souls pursuing this as “truth.”

Following excerpt under “History” on Wikipedia for Serpent Seed-click on and read full article to also read “Doctrine” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serpent_seed#History

The Serpent Seed idea appears in a 9th-century book called Pirke De-Rabbi Eliezer.[7] Rabbi David Max Eichhorn, in his book Cain: Son of the Serpent, traces the idea back through early Jewish Midrashic texts and identifies many rabbis who taught that Cain was the son of the union between the serpent and Eve.[7] Some Kabbalist rabbis also believe that Cain and Abel were of a different genetic background than Seth. This is known among Kabbalists as “The Theory of Origins“.[8] The theory teaches that God created two “Adams”(Adam means MAN in Hebrew). To one he gave a soul and to the other he did not give a soul. The one without a soul is the creature known in Christianity as the serpent. The Kabbalists call the serpent Nahash (meaning serpent in Hebrew). This is recorded in the Zohar:

“Two beings [Adam and Nachash] had intercourse with Eve, and she conceived from both and bore two children. Each followed one of the male parents, and their spirits parted, one to this side and one to the other, and similarly their characters. On the side of Cain are all the haunts of the evil species; from the side of Abel comes a more merciful class, yet not wholly beneficial — good wine mixed with bad.”(Zohar 136)

In The Scofield Study Bible Scofield says, “The serpent, in his Edenic form, is not to be thought of as a writhing reptile. That is the effect of the curse (Gen. 3:14). The creature which lent itself to Satan may well have been the most beautiful as it was the most “subtle” of creatures less than man”.[9] Scofield’s notes are silent as to the idea of Cain being the serpent’s seed, however in Genesis 6:2 his notes claimed that while it was an “error” to believe that the offspring mentioned were the product of supernatural unions, it was instead the intermarriage of the “godly line of Seth” with the “godless line of Cain” being referred to.[10] Advocates suggest that modern Christian translations of the Old Testament reduce emphasis on this concept, which they believe indicated the serpent had been an upright, human-like creature.

The foundational scripture for the serpent’s seed doctrine appears in Genesis 3:15, which in the King James Version states “And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.” Advocates interpret this literally to mean that an offspring of the Serpent via Eve would eventually lose in a mortal conflict with one of “her seed”. Eve’s son by Adam would have presumably been called “Adam’s seed” so it has been suggested, since a woman does not naturally produce seed, that “her seed” is the first prophesy of an eventual human messiah produced by means of a virgin birth. Adherents believe this sets up the serpent’s seed as an antitype to Jesus Christ.

Advocates also point out that in Genesis 4:1-2 it is mentioned only once that Adam “knew” his wife, yet twice it is mentioned that she “bare” sons (see, heteropaternal superfecundation). Advocates also believe an unmentioned act of infidelity is implied by reproductive and marital curses placed on Eve in Genesis 3:16, that otherwise seem inappropriate to merely eating a forbidden fruit. St. Paul seems to suggest as much in 2 Corinthians 11:2-3, where he may have implied that Eve was not a chaste virgin at the time Adam first had relations with her: “For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted…”

In the New Testament epistle of 1 John, ch. 3 v. xii it also states, “Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother.” John also recorded in his gospel (8:44) that Christ said, “Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him.” These passages, if taken literally as they are by advocates, seem to suggest that the New Testament writers believed that Cain, the first murderer, was indeed the serpent’s seed.

The doctrine that Eve mated with the serpent, or with Satan, to produce Cain, has been taught in various forms for thousands of years, and it finds its earliest expression in Gnostic writings (e.g., the Gospel of Philip) and especially in Manichaean doctrines; however, it was soundly rejected by mainstream Christian theologians such as Irenaeus [11] in the 2nd century, and St. Augustine in the 4th century.

More recent variants are central to the beliefs of Two-Seed-in-the-Spirit Predestinarian Baptists founded by Daniel Parker. Other variations occur in the Christian Identity movement. Some of these groups appear to use the doctrine as a rationalization for racist beliefs. One of the largest, but non-denominational, groups that believe in a form of the serpent seed doctrine are the followers of Branhamism who are documented to number over 1,500,000.

Woolwich London Attack End Game? Let’s ask the Controlled Oppostion.

This post is inspired by a simple question asked by a reader at N4TM, “What’s the end game (re: Woolwich Attack in London)?” From my Post: Woolwich Attack proves Delusion has gripped World Wide…

This is an open ended question really. There are so many possibilities for what the ‘End Game’ could be (and is) following an atrocious act such as Woolwich, London. Fermenting unrest is the easy obvious answer you see because that’s exactly what has been going on since the Woolwich “Attack.” There have been counter protests against Muslims, hate crimes against Muslims, threats to Muslims and an increasing hostility towards Muslims since Woolwich; however, there has been other crimes in the UK against non-Muslims by Muslims that is also aiding the fallout of Woolwich but won’t be addressed here. One of the main conspirators to the Anti-Islamic movement in the UK is a chap named, Tommy Robinson, head of the EDL (English Defense League). I am still learning about Tommy and I must say what I’m finding is a Global Controlled Opposition connection amongst the cover of being Anti-Islam. There’s a saying in the US, birds of a feather flock together, and another in the Bible, you will know them by their fruits. I must say what I’ve seen leads me to believe even more so that Woolwich was orchestrated.

EDL_logoIf you want to see the protests that have followed the Woolwich attack simply Google it and you’ll find that there are demonstrations taking place all over Britain. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/may/28/woolwich-murder-200-islamophobic-incidences - Some demonstrations are in support of the British Soldiers, some are in memoriam for Lee Rigby the slain soldier, and then there are others that are more “Far Right” is what they are calling them in London. The reference to “Far Right,” from what I have seen, indicates a bad connotation in England. The term is representative of more radical behavior than what we have seen so far in the US, and perhaps that is about to change. Maybe another bonus feature to the Woolwich fallout is that the US’ “Far Right” will get more radicalized and lose their inhibitions on acting out more violently and begin mirroring the group EDL of the UK. If that is a goal of the powers that be it would behoove the US citizen to become more aware of the EDL, what they stand for, and their leader as well. Of course Tommy Robinson is no stranger to the Zionists movement crowd in the US. America’s beloved vixen, Pamela Geller of American Thinker and Atlas Shrugs, has done well to introduce Tommy to the US already.

spencer Jihad Watch, gellar American Thinker_Atlas Shrugs, tommy robinson EDLSome of my readers may recognize the man on the Left; that is, Robert Spencer of Jihad Watch.org. Spencer is friends with a slew of Christian Speakers and is often in their circles. Spencer works with Joseph Farah of World Net Daily, and Jerome Corsi. Think…think…Christian, who else is in that group? Remember this?

jerome corsi Chuck Missler Thumbnail may be enlarged if you click on it. That is Jerome Corsi and Chuck Missler. I’ll revisit the Controlled Opposition Connections further down. First, what you need to know about Tommy Robinson.

Corsi Gellar SpencerSmall world eh..

First thing you should know about “Tommy” is he’s treated like a Rock Star in the UK. Check out this short video Tommy Robinson, highly protected, walking through the streets practically being worshiped.

He is also charismatic. Here’s another link to watch one of his speeches he gave at one of his most recent rally’s: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=bf9_1369554298

But “Tommy Robinson” is not Tommy Robinson. BIO by Wikipedia with links disabled.

Stephen Yaxley-Lennon (born 27 November 1982), who has identification documents with the name Paul Harris,[2] and also known by the pseudonym Tommy Robinson, is an English political activist.[3] Robinson is the co-founder,[4] spokesman and leader of the English Defence League (EDL) “street protest” movement. He has led the EDL since 2009. For a short time 2012 Robinson was joint Party Vice Chairman of the British Freedom Party alongside fellow English Defence League member Kevin Carroll.

Robinson was born in Luton to Irish immigrant parents.[5] Robinson has said, “Sixty per cent of Luton is Irish. Nearly every single one of my friends is Irish. I’m proud to have Irish heritage but I call myself English.”[6] He married in 2011 and is the father of three children.[7] His family is under 24-hour police protection due to claims that a minority of extremist Muslims may be after him, and he wears protection when appearing in public.[8][9] Lennon owns a sunbed shop in Luton. However, Robinson reported on Twitter in March 2013 that “Polish girls took the shop over”.[9]

Lennon uses the alias “Tommy Robinson”, taking the name of a prominent member of the “Men In Gear” (MIG) football hooligan crew, which follows Luton Town Football Club. The real Robinson wrote two books, published in 2006 and 2007, which give an inside perspective of his own life and of those around him.[10] Robinson was involved in the group United Peoples of Luton, formed in response to a March 2009 protest against Royal Anglian Regiment troops returning from the Afghan War[11] organised by the Islamist group Al-Muhajiroun and including members of the group Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah.[12][13] In August 2009, he became the leading figure of the newly established English Defence League. He appeared masked in public at first, until the Sunday Mercury newspaper managed to photograph his face in April 2010.[14]

In 2012 Robinson announced he had joined the British Freedom Party and was appointed joint vice chairman along with fellow English Defence League member Kevin Carroll after the two groups agreed an electoral pact in 2011.[15] On 11 October 2012, Robinson resigned from the BFP to concentrate on EDL activities.[16]

Searchlight magazine identified the “Tommy Robinson” involved with the EDL as Lennon, and reported that he had served a twelve months prison sentence for assaulting an off-duty police officer who had intervened to stop a domestic incident between Lennon and his partner Jenna Vowles.[14] He was convicted on 18 April 2005 for assault occasioning actual bodily harm and assault with intent to resist arrest while his partner was cautioned for possession of cocaine.[17]

On 24 August 2010, Robinson was involved in a fight between supporters of Luton Town and Newport County in Luton, on the evening the two clubs played at Kenilworth Road. Lennon reportedly led the group of Luton fans, and played an integral part in starting the 100-man brawl, during which he chanted “EDL till I die”. Eleven months later, in July 2011, he was convicted of having used “threatening, abusive or insulting behaviour” on the night of the incident. He was given a 12-month community rehabilitation order and a three-year ban from attending football matches. He was also sentenced to 150 hours’ unpaid work, and ordered to pay £650 in costs.[18]

Robinson was arrested after an EDL demonstration in Tower Hamlets on 3 September 2011 for breach of bail conditions, as he had been banned from attending the demonstration. After his arrest, Robinson began a hunger strike in custody in Bedford Prison, saying he was a “political prisoner of the state” [19] and refused to eat what he believed was halal meat.[20] A local paper reported that Bedford Prison sources said the hunger strike lasted less than 24 hours.[21] A handful of EDL supporters protested outside the prison in support of Robinson during his incarceration, peaking in a turnout of 100 protesters on 10 September.[22][23][24] Robinson was released from prison on 12 September.[25]

On 29 September 2011 he was convicted of common assault after headbutting a fellow EDL member at a rally in Blackburn in April that year. The judge stated that a custodial sentence could not be ruled out.[26]

On 8 November 2011, Robinson held a protest against the ban on wearing a poppy for the England team on the rooftop of the FIFA building in Zurich. He was fined £3000 and jailed for three days.[27]

On 7 January 2013 Robinson pleaded guilty at Southwark Crown Court to using someone else’s passport—”possession of a false identity document with improper intention”—to travel to the United States in September 2012, and was sentenced to 10 months imprisonment.[28] He was sentenced under the name of Stephen Lennon, but the judge added that he suspected it was not his true name, in the sense that it was not the name on his own passport (not the borrowed one), Paul Harris. Robinson was released on Electronic tag on 22 February 2013.[29]

Weird stuff. “Tommy Robinson” aka Stephen Lennon tied to Nazis, yet he used a fake passport to come the US to speak at SION, an event hosted by Robert Spencer and Pamella Geller (Jews) who are also against Muslims. Hmm, weird.

**Please note if you don’t notice anything else at all in this video, notice what he says about what’s to come for the British Soldiers…this was a conference done on September 11, 2012. The very day that Ambassador Stevens was assassinated in Benghazi Libya. (another false flag)

SION 9.11.2012 frist session of World Congress in Defense of Free SpeechClick on ‘SION’ poster to enlarge.

http://freedomdefense.typepad.com/sion/current-affairs/

Back to the CONTROLLED OPPOSITION connections.

I don’t know very much about Tommy Robinson/Stephen Lennon, but I’ll tell you that in the US we are not ignorant of the story line he’s using. We’ve heard similar scripts about men (and women) using aliases to hide their identity. We’ve heard the script about the “death threats” to certain speakers who are speaking out “against” Islam. [Walid Shoebat, Avi Lipkin, Brigitte Gabriel, Ergun Caner] We’ve already been primed for that script, ESPECIALLY the Christian who sits in those Prophesy Conferences and buys the books and speaker tapes/MP3′s/DVD’s of those people who’ve been inserted into our sub-culture. When a “speaker” shows up with ARMED DETAIL, there’s your sign. Sorry, but I don’t believe they are who they say they are.

Here’s an Example of Pre-Conditioning:

Gellar and Spencer make their Calvary Chapel circutSome of my readers know the names I’ve already exposed like, Chuck Missler, and the full gamut of Calvary Chapel. The screen grab shows a showing of “The Ground Zero Mosque,” and the special guest at the local Calvary Chapel Church (that is not a denomination but is pyramidal in its Moses seat false teaching on church government) were Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer. Don’t forget Chuck Missler was on of the originals who helped launch Calvary Chapel, although he’s claimed to be a graduate of Louisiana Baptist College, he works exclusively in the CC circle.

Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer: ‘The Ground Zero Mosque – The Second Wave of the 9/11 Attacks’, Calvary Chapel, Mission Viejo, April 9, 2011

It’s a double cross!

One last thing I want to show you. I saw these images before today but now that I’ve done some digging on “Tommy” and the “EDL” it is a little clearer. I will try to just show you the images and see if you can figure it out on your own without me explaining, if you have questions I’ll be happy to answer in the comments section.

EDL Twitter avitar In Hoc Signo VincesYork Rite Freemasonry in hoc signo vincesWoolwich Army Barracks memorial site after knifing of LeeWoolwich Army Barracks London Englandtim laHaye Power of the Cross Knights Templar symbolismskip Heitzig General Boykin Joel Rosenberg Greg Laurie Tim LaHaye YouseffImages will enlarge if you click on them.

Boykin don JesuitSmall World eh..

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_does_in_hoc_signo_vinces_mean

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/mosques-attacked-london-250-angry-members-english-defence-league-threw-rocks-fought-police-area-woolwich-arsenal-scene-beheading-attack-article-1.1352575

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/uk/woolwich-attack-antifascist-groups-plan-counterdemos-as-english-defence-league-plans-marches-in-30-locations-across-uk-29307940.html

Hackers post ‘EDL members’ contact details’ online- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22698510

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/41048_Mitt__Romney_Pamela_Geller_EDLs_Tommy_Robinson_Robert_Spencer_and_John_Bolton

http://www.despatch.cth.com.au/Misc/LahayMasonic.htm

http://englishdefenceleague.org/edl-news-2/1924-sponsor-tommy

http://www.loonwatch.com/2012/10/edl-leader-and-bedfordshire-police-commissioner-candidate-says-all-muslims-are-backward-savages/ (Kevin Caroll is a cousin of “Tommy Robinson” aka Stephen Lennon EDL leader. Both are pictured with Pamella Geller and Robert Spencer at top of post.)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-20138869

N4TM has done several posts exposing William Jerry Boykin as a Jesuit (“Knight”) but others have done articles too. Jesuitism is not new to CC, google Nelson Bunker Hunt a Jesuit and ties to Nazism. Nothing new under the sun…

 

DO NOT believe Beck

Things have gotten to a whole new level of weirdness. Without having the time to explain, I simply ask you to not believe Glenn Beck and his new level of insanity. Reader, please be careful. Test all things.

Here’s an update on why I posted this latest warning on Glenn Beck. I saw several tweets this afternoon by BeckBots (my term for those who follow Glenn Beck blindly and defend him vehemently) that Glenn Beck is Warning Barack Obama to tell the truth to the public or ‘he’ (Glenn Beck) will. There is a WND (World Net Daily) article that is helping in this propaganda. I just viewed this YouTube video posted by Right Wing Media:

I don’t know exactly what Glenn Beck is trying to do, but he has a lot of followers who follow everything he says without any consideration for whom Glenn Beck really serves. I’ve warned extensively about Glenn Beck and that Christians should stop listening to him. Glenn Beck is a liar and a deceiver and he’s been leading Christians away from the truth. Beck is serving Mammon, he worships a false christ, and he is deceiving many for an even greater evil than his belly. If Glenn is being used to stir the American people into a frenzy of false information he would certainly qualify as a useful idiot for the role. He’s revered enough to instigate a civil disruption, of which would only serve Obama’s purposes. I don’t for a second believe Glenn Beck is on the side of “Truth” or the “American Way.” Here is the WND article: click here. I do not endorse WND, the founders of WND are connected to CNP and Jesuits. Beck has hosted Jesuit, Ret. General William Gerry Boykin. There appears to be a severe spiritual purpose behind these latest actions. I caution those who claim to be born again Christians who follow Glenn Beck to test him and his motives. We are not to believe every spirit but we should be testing them to see if they are truly followers of Christ. One key consideration, who is the author of Confusion? Is Glenn Beck causing confusion and hysteria? He keeps his readers and listeners in a constant state of frenzy and hopelessness as though impending doom lurks around every corner, is that Christ-like?

Chuck Smith Jr Writes N4TM: Chuck Smith Jr’s Response to Being a “Straight Ally For Gay Christians” among other things

Chuck Smith Jrchuck smith, jr.

Remarkable! It was interesting to read that I am “an advocate” for homosexual Christians. This is an example of either inadequate research or selective reporting–either one, in my opinion, demonstrates a lack of integrity. In that same video interview posted above, I explicitly stated that “I am not an advocate” for gay and lesbian Christians.

Have I sat “in the company” of homosexuals in conferences without delivering a word of judgment against them? Yes, I have. I went to them the way Jesus came into the world, not to condemn, but to save. And as He was sent into the world, so He sent His disciples into the world (Jn. 3:17; 17:18; 20:21). How many of these conferences have you been invited to come and speak? If none, how are do you plan on getting the gospel to gays and lesbians? Do you care whether they hear the gospel? Is it not your calling or concern?

You are misinformed regarding my contact with Roman Catholicism. I have never advocated for, or endorsed Thomas Merton. However, if he said something quotable that glorified God, I would not shrink back from quoting him. If Paul was comfortable quoting pagan poets and prophets, why should I avoid quoting someone whose beliefs I do not fully share? (Acts 17:28; Titus 1:12) There is a well-known fallacy of logic, argumentum ad hominem, which states that if you discredit the person, you discredit his argument, which in this case is tantamount to saying “Thomas Merton” was a Trappist monk, so everything Thomas Merton said was wrong.” People who may be wrong about everything else can still be right on one thing. As John Warwick Montgomery, conservative Christian theologian and apologist, said, “It’s hard to be wrong about EVERYTHING.”

By the way, I miss the days when to be a Christian apologist one had to be well-versed in logic, theology, philosophy, history, and original languages, as well as have an excellent knowledge of the entire Bible. John W. Montgomery is one of the few well-known apologists who are the real deal.

I have never advocated Roman Catholic dogma. My understanding of “contemplative prayer” is not drawn from Roman Catholicism, but from the Scriptures and especially the Psalms–which have been the source of hymns, prayer, and spiritual songs of God’s people for millennia. I have read many Roman Catholic authors including John Cassian, St. Augustine, Anselm, and Thomas Aquinas (most bonafide Christian apologists have also read Anselm, Augustine, and Aquinas). Furthermore, my reading list includes several works by Russian and Greek Orthodox theologians. I have also read The Institutes of John Calvin (who was a great fan of Augustine and quotes him frequently) and a host of other theological works and biblical commentaries by evangelical and fundamentalist authors. Martin Luther was also deeply interested in contemplative spirituality and strongly endorsed the work “The Theological Germanica.” But the only books I read without filters are the sixty-six books of the Bible.

On the other hand, many Protestants have been misled by anti-Catholic authors who have invented historical connections between Roman Catholicism and ancient pagan religions (such as Alexander Hislop’s “Two Babylons”). Not that I am defending everything that Roman Catholics around the world believe or do in the name of their religion. Nevertheless, I would not be surprised if the percentage of Roman Catholics who actually please God by walking with Him every day is at least as high as the percentage of Protestants who do so. Although I personally disapprove of praying to saints, I cannot believe that it is any worse than self-righteousness and hypocrisy.

You are wrong about me (actually, the church where I was Senior Pastor at the time) being “kicked out” of CC on the grounds that we were “emergent.” By the way, mijadedios, your “dove club” label is an uncharitable stab, to say the least, despite how deeply you feel CC deserves your ridicule. Anyway, that misinformation, sadly, came from my Uncle Paul. On at least three different occasions I carefully explained to him why neither I nor CBC were emergent. But he wasn’t listening to me because he had another agenda. Since he seemed uncomfortable in my meeting with him and had difficulty getting around to the point for wanting to see me, I asked him if it would be easier for him if I just removed CBC from the CC affiliation. He was instantly relieved and said answered, “Yes.”

Paul and a couple of his buddies at CCOF (during that period of time) had heard rumors about me and CBC that they never sought to substantiate for themselves by contacting me or visiting the church. They led a campaign to malign our work and to get us removed from the CC affiliation. I did not resist them, because it was something that mattered more to them than it did to me. Years ago, God impressed upon my heart that He is not into “brand” names, that the only name He endorses is the name above all names–that of His only begotten Son, Jesus Christ.

One of my uncle’s friends went on to slander me on blogs and in print, accusing me of spending a sabbatical in a monastery (I didn’t) and returning to my church to hang icons so that people could pray to them (never happened). There were thousands of people who attended CBC over the years, so it would be easy enough to find just one person to corroborate that author’s claim. But no one ever will, because I have never believed in praying to icons and never taught anyone to pray to icons.

As far as Lonnie goes, why don’t you talk to people who knew him in order to get at the truth? Why do you think you can learn everything you need to know from video clips, articles, and other blogs? Do you let other people read the Bible for you or do you read it for yourself? Do you take just bits and pieces of the Bible and dismiss the rest? If you don’t trust others enough to let them tell you what the Bible says, why do you give them your full trust when it comes to other Christians–Christians you could easily contact or whose close friends and family are reachable? Why are you so quick to find flaws in others and then rush to condemn them? Really! Do you believe this pleases God? In fact, among the things that God hates are “A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.” (KJV, on David’s behalf–my first Bible and the version I read through cover-to-cover before reading through any other. It is also my dad’s favorite and that which he most frequently quotes verbatim.)

Lonnie did not consider himself a homosexual and he believed that homosexual sex was a sin. He never endorsed homosexuality. When I first heard of his past (i.e., prior to his conversion to Jesus Christ), he had renounced it and considered himself a “new creature in Christ.” He was married to Connie at the time and he certainly did not continue “to act out openly in gay relationships throughout his life” (I find this statement of N4TM’s especially offensive, because it is an outright lie). I witnessed times when Lonnie prayed over other people that they would be delivered from their temptation to engage in homosexual sex.

Lonnie and I did not remain friends through the years, mostly because we got on two different tracks in ministry with two different emphases. I was not his greatest fan, but I didn’t criticize him either. After all is said and done, Lonnie was a child of God who struggled.

What do we call it when someone attributes motives to another person without having an accurate (or even close to accurate) understanding of the details? Again, it is remarkable to me that Christians behave the way they do, assuming that because they’re convinced their doctrine is more orthodox than another person’s, they are justified in making up stories or motives about that person. What happened with our weekly meetings in the Fromm’s home was no “publicity stunt.” A few corrections:

Chuck Fromm is the publisher of Worship Leader Magazine, not Leadership (Journal). He did not “found” Maranatha! Music, but he did run it for approximately thirty-five years.

Chuck and Stephanie have had many Bible studies in their home. It was a neighbor’s complaint about our meetings there that involved the city government, which imposed a fine on the Fromms for hosting weekly meetings. The Fromm’s initial attempts to meet with the city government and work this out were ignored and then shut down. That is when the Pacific Justice Institute got involved (I don’t know what the ACLJ is, but I certainly don’t have access to it–or to the ACLU). The lawyers with the Pacific Justice Institute defend the rights of churches all over the U.S. (and were also strong proponents of Prop. 8). They had won a similar case in San Diego county the previous year. They took the issue to the press and within a few weeks the city issued an apology, admitted that their initial response to our meetings was too aggressive, promised to review the law on their books (prohibiting weekly meetings in homes), and the whole thing was quickly settled out of court. It’s true that the Pacific Justice Institute was interested in carrying the case further, hoping to get a landmark decision in a higher court, but that wasn’t what we wanted. In fact, we had already moved our Bible study by the time the city submitted its apology. If it had been a publicity stunt, we certainly would have carried it further. However, we never exploited the media attention that arrived at the Fromm’s front door and I never consented to an interview. From the start, I wanted peace with the city.

Good Grief, mijadedios! I don’t know what else to say, except that it’s simply rotten of you to glibly refer to this ordeal as a publicity stunt. For what purpose would we do such a thing? What got publicized? The name of our small community of believers was never mentioned. If you had any idea of what the Fromm’s suffered from this whole thing or if you had even a meager understanding of their love for the Lord Jesus Christ and devotion to His people, I doubt you would smugly dismiss this unhappy season of their lives as a publicity stunt. However, God who works all things together for good, used this experience to introduce the Fromm’s to city hall and they are now on good terms with the city’s leaders. In fact, Chuck Fromm is friends with the Mayor who is also a born again Christian.

Yes, I’ve sat in the radio station with my dad a few times to answer questions on Pastor’s Perspective over the last couple of years. Each time, it was at Dad’s request when Don Stewart was out of town. Whatever it may mean to you that my dad asked me to be a guest on his show, please present to me one instance when an answer I gave contradicted the clear teaching of the Bible. If you can prove that I misinterpreted the Scriptures, I will return to this blog site, apologize, and change my view. If you cannot, then why make a big deal about me going on the air with my father? Also, if you discover that I provided a biblical answer to someone that reflected both a good understanding of God’s word and compassion for the caller, would you consider apologizing to me?

unhihodedios

N4TM’s response:

I think the above, “unhihodedios,” was an attempt to say I’m not a child of God. Mija de Dios means Daughter of God. *It just occurred to me that this was Chuck Jr signing ‘Un hijo de dios’ translation: “A child of God.” Sorry, I don’t speak spanish so it took me a while to figure that one out.* I appreciate all you have to say here and I’m grateful to hear from you. It is more than I’ve heard from anyone I’ve written about. I have a lot to consider in what you are saying above and will take time to read through over and over and truly understand and discern the obvious aggravation from my accusations from the truth you are trying to convey. I’m glad you took the time to address the issues I brought up not just in the “Straight Ally for Gay Christians” piece I wrote, but you are also, very clearly, reading and addressing many posts I’ve written on Calvary Chapel including posts on Chuck From and Lonnie Frisbee. May I say that I do not harbor any personal hatred for you or even your father for that matter. What I do find heart wrenching and discouraging is the false teaching that’s been promoted for years, the lies that have been perpetuated, the people who have been used and abused by the CC system and much much more. But I am not about “Discrediting” or “Slandering” you. I was calling it as I see, yes with the limited information I have that I gather online, through hours of video, transcripts, personal experience, etc. Again I say, “Thank You,” and I will consider all the things you present here. I may take time to edit this reply after reading through your comment more carefully or I may chose to leave the issue alone, it depends on how the Lord leads.